2008 ETEC 150 fuel pump problems

[deerhunter1]

Looking for advice as I can't wait 3-4 weeks to get into a certified repair shop and miss all of May b*** fishing!!! Purchased my boat this Spring and took down to lake for first time a few weeks ago. Ran great for the first hour or so. After fishing an area for 45 min or so with trolling motor I went to start the outboard and would not run. Once I did finally get started, it would idle for a bit and then die. Pumped the bulb up and trimmed the motor up and down and could get to run for just a bit and then die again. Changed the fuel filter and pumped the bulb while it was off and fuel goes through there. Had a guy I know check it out and he found that fuel line had a somewhat loose connection thinking it may have air in the line and thought it was good. Took to the lake this weekend and the problem repeated immediately after I got off the trailer. I did find that once I could get it running, I could pump up the primer bulb as it was running and hear the engine rev up a bit as I was pumping and then would run a bit longer before finally dying again. I've ordered a new lift pump from boats.net and going to try that first. Without being able to get anyone to look at it that is my best guess. Next step would be the high pressure pump/check voltage there. Any suggestions or feedback would be appreciated.

[Joe Reeves]

I believe that what you are saying is that this 2008 510hp ETC rig is "new" to you and you don't know the history behind it.

First, do this just to get it out of the way, and possess the knowledge one way or the other.... basic troubleshooting procedure.

Remove all spark plugs. Check the compression... what is the psi reading of all the individual cylinders?

Check the spark with a spark tester whereas you can set an adjustable gap of 7/16" (The gap is important... testing spark by using the spark plugs is a waste of time). The spark should jump that gap with a strong blue lightning like flame... a real SNAP! Single plug testers are available at auto parts stores... you can also easily built this one:

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(Spark Tester - Home Made)
(J. Reeves)

You can use a medium size philips screwdriver (#2 I believe) inserted into the spark plug boot spring connector, then hold the screwdriver shank approximately 7/16" away from the block to check the spark or build the following:

A spark tester can be made with a piece of 1x4 or 1x6, drive a few finishing nails through it, then bend the pointed ends at a right angle. You can then adjust the gap by simply twisting the nail(s). Solder a spark plug wire to one which you can connect to the spark plug boots, and a ground wire of some kind to the other to connect to the powerhead somewhere. Use small alligator clips on the other end of the wires to connect to ground and to the spark plug connector that exists inside of the rubber plug boot.

Using the above, one could easily build a spark tester whereas they could connect 2, 4, 6, or 8 cylinders all at one time. The ground nail being straight up, the others being bent, aimed at the ground nail. A typical 4 cylinder tester follows:

..........X1..........X2

.................X..(grd)

..........X3..........X4

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Voltage To Powerpack Failures
(Magneto Capacitance Discharge Systems)
(J. Reeves)

The usual cause of having those type powerpacks fail repeatedly is having a very small of voltage applied to the Black/Yellow wire (Kill Circuit) at the pack. Test as follows.
Disconnect the Black/Yellow wire at the powerpack.

Insert either a ampere meter or a volt meter set to its lowest DC voltage reading between that Black Yellow wire on the wiring harness side, NOT the powerpack side and ground.

With the ignition key in the OFF position, observe the meter reading. Now turn the ignition key to the ON position and again observe the meter reading.

Any reading, movement of the meter needle, even a microvolt, would indicate that battery voltage is being applied to that Black/Yellow wire. If a reading is present, remove the other end of that Black/Yellow from the raised terminal of the ignition switch.

If the reading ceases to exist when the Black/Yellow wire is removed from the ignition switch, replace the switch. If the reading continues to exist, there would be a short of some kind in either the engine or instrument wiring harness.... to determine which, simply unplug the large RED electrical plug at the engine which would eliminate the instrument cable.

Note that the black/yellow wire must not have any other wire attached to it for the following reason!

Keep in mind that any accessory that has 12 volts running to it, especially when turned on, will have voltage flowing thru it and trailering out thru its black ground wire to complete the circuit. If that accessory has it's black ground wire attached to the "M" terminal that the black/yellow wire is attached to.... you will have voltage flowing directly to the power-pack.
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I retired in 1991 so various aspects of your engine would be foreign to me, however much remains the same through the years, hence my answer here.

Your engine does not incorporate a electric choke (butterflies), it incorporates a Fuel Primer Solenoid, as follows:
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(Fuel Primer Solenoid Function)
(J. Reeves)

The RED lever...... The normal operating/running position is to have that red lever positioned over top of the solenoid and aimed at the other end of the solenoid, gently turned to its stop. This is the normal/automatic mode position. Pushing the key in opens the valve within the solenoid allowing fuel to pa$$ thru it in order to prime and start the engine. Looking upon this solenoid as a electric choke results in a better understanding of it.

Having that red lever turned in the opposite direction, facing away from the solenoid, allows fuel to flow thru it to the crankcase area. One would only turn the red lever to this position in a case where the battery might go dead and the engine had to be started via the rope pull method. Look upon putting the red lever in this position as moving a choke lever on a choke equipped engine to the full closed position. Either one would supply fuel to the crankcase/engine for starting purposes BUT if left in that position while running would flood the engine.

The later model primer solenoids are equipped with a schrader valve, used for attaching a pressurized can of fogging oil etc, available at your local dealership with complete instructions.

Pumping the fuel primer bulb up hard fills the carburetor float chambers of course, but that process also applies fuel pressure to the primer solenoid.

The two small hoses leading from the primer solenoid branch off via tees to each fuel manifold section that would feed fuel to the individual cylinders.

Pushing the key in activates the primer solenoid to allow fuel to flow thru it to the intake manifold pa$$ageways. Cranking the engine over causes the fuel pump to engage which in turn sends fuel pulses to the primer solenoid via the 3/8" fuel hose.

Some engines incorporates the "Fast Start" feature which automatically advances the spark electronically so no advance of the throttle is required for starting.
Engines that do not have the "Fast Start" feature will be required to have the throttle advanced slightly.

Starting procedure: pump fuel bulb up hard, crank engine and push the key in at the same time. When the engine fires/starts, release the key so that it falls back to the run position.

Bottom line..... Look upon the primer solenoid as an electric choke.
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Now..... You say that initially the engine ran for an hour or so, after which I a$$ume you shut it down normally (hadn't acted up yet) to fish with your trolling motor, then after about a hour, this is where you first encountered the starting problem.

That normally indicates an ignition problem which is self contained. The stator under the flywheel is the beginning of the ignition system and supplies approximately 300 ACv to the power-pack capacitor in order to energize the power-pack. The stator on that model is normally a 35amp stator and as such, all coils would be exposed and would have two large black coils located at the extreme rear of it. These two coils are the ones that power the power-pack.

That stator is prone to overheating, resulting in a meltdown of either or both of those large black coils which in turn result in weak, erratic, and eventually no spark/ignition. Check that stator visually, closely. If there is a sticky looking substance dripping drown on the power-head area, replace the stator. When cold, the stator in that condition may function fine... BUT... as it heats up, the igniton is sure to fail.

Your engine ran fine, then you shut it down, the water drains out of the powerhead, all the heat of the engine raised to the top underside of the hood, adding more heat to that stator... can't get away from it! It may be fine, BUT check it closely!

Now, you say that pumping the fuel primer bulb caused the rpms to increase. When you pump that primer bulb, does it snap back to its original shape... OR... is it slow coming back? When the engine's running at a fairly high rpm, does the primer bulb have a tendency to collapse? Either of these cases indicate a sticking Anti Siphon Valve as follows:

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(Fuel Anti Siphon Valve)
(J. Reeves)

Many of the later OMC V/6 engines incorporate a fuel restriction warning via a vacuum device attached to the powerhead. If the engine overheats, or if you have a fuel restriction, the warning is the same.... a steady constant beep.

NOTE... Only the V/6 & V/8 engines have the above "Fuel Restriction Warning". The warning horn will not sound on the other models.

The fact that a engine is not overheating, but the warning horn sounds off with a constant steady beep, and that the rpms drop drastically would indicate that the engine is starving for fuel due to a fuel restriction. Check the built in fuel tank where the rubber fuel line attaches to the tank fitting. That fitting is in all probability a "Anti Siphon" valve which is notorious for sticking in a semi closed position. It will be aluminum, about 2" long, and the insides of it will consist of a spring, a ball, and a ball seat. If this valve exists, remove it, knock out those inner components which will convert it to a straight through fitting, then re-install it. Hopefully that cures the problem.

The above procedure will cure a restriction problem with the anti siphon valve as stated. BUT, it may also allow fuel to drain backwards to the fuel tank when the engine is not running (siphoning backwards) due to the fact that the carburetors/fuel pump etc are higher than the fuel tank. This condition is not an absolute as the valves in the fuel primer bulb usually prevent this backwards siphoning problem. However.... if this does take place, the cure would be to install a new anti siphon valve.
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Let us know what you find.

[deerhunter1]

thank you so much for the information!! I downloaded a service manual for the engine yesterday also and found out there are diagnostic LED's. I got to this point late last night and did not get to go much further but I did turn on the key and check the LED's. Found that LED #1 does not light up at all when the key is turned on like it should. Per the manual, it says "LED 1 - CHARGING OK - Stator signal 30 V or higher. For NO LIGHT, check for: SAC circuit problem". This tells me that I'll likely be sending my fuel pump parts back! Based on what I read, it could be the stator, capacitor, or EMM. This really stinks because if one of these dealers could at least plug the thing in and get the code it would at least tell me what the exact problem is. I'm going to test the voltage on these components tonight and hopefully it is something that I can fix. I can't see waiting 3-4 weeks and miss the rest of the Spring Fishing season!!

[deerhunter1]

update to what I posted.

Did the capacitor test as specified on page 122 of service manual. Resistance reading increased gradually so according to this, it is working correctly.

Checked voltage on the red/white wires at J2 connector of EMM.
with key turned to "on", I have ZERO volts once we can get it to turn over and run for 10 seconds or so, it jumps up to 55 volts

Regardless of key on, off, or started, I have ZERO volts going to the high pressure fuel pump.

I'm no boat mechanic, but if following most of this I hate to say it but seems like a bad EMM ... Any type of feedback would be appreciated.

[jelasea]

Emm

If you have not solved the problem you may want to call this number
1-844-627-2255 This is a repair facility for your EMM. They should be able to help you solve the problem.